20 Comments
Nov 8Liked by Grow Some Labia

It seems the choice is not between forming your children and letting them grow into what they will naturally become.

It's between forming your children and letting the culture do it for you.

By taking a hands-off approach, you are not freeing your children from authoritarian influence; you are simply passing the job off to schools, the internet, etc.

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If you start the job at home, though, you can potentially arm them against those who would be authoritarian or suck you into crazy crap like this trans stuff. You can't avoid all outside influences, of course. As the Bible states, "Train up a child in the way he should go, and when he is old he will not depart from it." That's not always true, kids can turn out way different from the way they were raised, for better or for worse, but it can prepare them to resist some of the less helpful or useful culture.

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I also think you’re underestimating the effect of being very empathetic and well informed. There is just too much suffering in a country of 300 million and a world of 8 billion and the internet to handle this if you don’t have theoretical/philosophical structure that tells you why it’s okay to be happy despite that. Conservatives operate on a sort of “they aren’t like us” worldview that protects you but liberals encourage “they are just like you.” I’m working on a long post/theory that makes the case of why it’s not moral to “witness” suffering.

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I'm pretty entirely certain I've done more research than you have. I've read books; I subscribe to Substacks that discuss these issues; I read about them when they hit the news. Have you read the WPATH Files? I have. If you haven't, you're not as well informed as you think. Don't be put off by the size of the download; the report itself is only 170 pages and very well- and engagingly-written. The rest of it is documentation of how much these people KNOW they're harming children, and don't have science to back up what they're doing, and worry more about what will happen if conservatives get their hands on the actual data than they are about doing no harm, as the Hippocratic Oath states. But then, several of them aren't doctors; they're only transctivists, so they don't take an oath to do no harm.

The Cass Review is even longer; I'm not sure I'm going to read the whole thing but I do plan to skim it. Having read the WPATH Files already, and the documentation behind it, I expect a lot of it will be redundant.

I'm not quite sure what you're trying say after the first sentence but keep in mind, while i appreciate your desire not to watch people suffer, it's cruel to offer someone a bandaid when they're suffering from cancer. And it's cruel to treat mental distress with a gender change bandaid when you haven't even asked the patient *why* they're suffering mentally.

It's interesting how until fifteen years ago, there was no such thing as a 'trans kid' or 'born in the wrong body' until the invention of such ideas on social media.

I don't think you prefer to look at these issues too deeply.

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I really don’t get the hysteria I see about trans kids. This is 0.02% of kids (who take puberty blockers)! It’s a tiny number! The number of kids in foster care is far far greater and the harm done to them is IMHO likely much greater as well.

If kids want to transition socially (name, pronouns, dress) why the hell not? If you don’t make a big deal out of it they won’t have any barriers to dropping it a year later (as I’ve seen happen.) No harm done except some interesting exploration of what gender is.

Of course social media influences kids. Of course it’s very unlikely that more than 1% of the population is what we used to think of as trans. Of course serious medical steps need a parent’s permission for kids and of course serious surgery is inadvisable if it can be avoided. But young adults who are going through with surgery are in fact almost certainly in a ton of serious distress- and I don’t know that removing breasts is any more life changing horrible than becoming anorexic or an alcoholic or a meth addict, also very dangerous ways people deal with psychological problems.

Parents that let and pay (and encourage?) to have their minor kids get nose jobs or boob jobs are freaking nuts in my opinion and I don’t mind making it illegal but it isn’t. I’m comfortable that a kid that is really sure and their parents that are really sure and doctors that are really sure are probably making the best decision for them at the time - most of the time, and it’s none of my business.

I’m all for more research though and getting more updated information. But not for demonizing and being cruel to people.

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Kids shouldn't be taking puberty blockers unless they're hitting puberty far too early. That's what they're for. When you take them for that purpose and go off them when you don't need them, there's pretty much no harm done to your body. They're not designed to stave off normal puberty and why the hell are kids so messed up today that they can't handle growing up? Being adults? We couldn't WAIT to grow up when we were young. The younger generations seem to want to remain perpetual children. Puberty is a normal milestone in the growing human. The glaringly obvious question y'all aren't asking is, "Why is puberty something kids can't handle anymore? What will they want next, to stop breathing?"

You're right that these kids are in a ton of distress but why are so few psychologically evaluated *before* exploring gender distress, if that latter needs to be explored at all? Glaringly obvious question: When did 'sex change operation' become the default bandaid for everything? It's a seriously life-changing decision and kids aren't old enough to know whether they want to have kids or not - that's light-years of decision making away. They have no idea what an orgasm is so don't know what they're missing out if their sexual organs are damaged. Until the trans-mania it would have been unthinkable to even suggest such a thing - medical professionals could have lost their licenses over it. Why don't y'all ever ask the glaringly obvious question, "An entire DSM-V full of mental disorders and everything is fixed by a sex change operation?"

Some boob & nose jobs might be warranted for minors; those who have really large breasts which can be hell on the back and noses that don't work properly or are just ridiculously large. But kids weren't getting nose and boob jobs at the rate they're getting sex change operations; and nose and boob jobs don't ruin your life; they can be fixed, usually, if you don't like them. Once your boobs are cut off, it's hasta la vista, babies! And 'bottom surgery' often results in loss of sexual feeling and inability to orgasm or to have painful orgasms.

I agree about not demonizing and being cruel to people. So the trans cultists can stop demonizing feminists, parents, critics, and medical professionals blowing the whistle on their peers who are still performing essentially medical experiments on children. The transitioning movement is growing and law firms are forming dedicated solely to handling these cases. Someone who doesn't believe in cruelty should understand how cruel it is to perform these unresearched medical experiments on children.

I just don't get why you people don't ask the glaringly obvious questions.

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Oct 23Liked by Grow Some Labia

BTW, I have to believe that Haidt won’t touch the trans issue with a ten foot pole because if he did it would discredit him to so many people and limit his audience. But there’s no way, in my opinion, that someone who’s done all the research he has doesn’t see it. I’m actually glad he doesn’t address it because there’s a chance my kid would be open to his message, but if he was a known gender critical voice she would completely discount everything he says.

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Interesting observation. What does she think about his social media is harmful message? If she's amenable to it, maybe you can persuade her to spend less time on social media. I really do think we'd *all* do well to stay off social media more. I'm on it only a little, mostly so I have time to write. I was on it a LOT more before I started writing seriously, and I was a lot more miserable.

I have a liberal friend who fell down the left-wing conspiracy theory rabbit holes over the pandemic, and he's become a much angrier, more easily triggered person because of it ;(

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Oct 24Liked by Grow Some Labia

I haven’t yet been able to get my daughter to read Haidt’s book, but at least it’s a possibility. I look for opportunities to expose her to messages that I think might be helpful for shifting her mindset without making it obvious that I’m trying to influence. I have his book and it’s on my list of things to mention when the opportunity comes up to work it into conversation.

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Oct 27Liked by Grow Some Labia

Thank you! Yes, Eliza is one of the best writers on the topic and this article is already saved to my list of “things I wish my daughter would read“.

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A few months ago when I was reading it - the hardcover edition - I made sure to hold it up on the subway so people could see the title. I noticed a few young people looking at it curiously. No one said anything to me, but I hope I made them curious.

I hope your daughter comes around. BTW, you might find this helpful, if you haven't seen it already:

https://genspect.org/gender-as-a-body-modification-youth-subculture/

Eliza Mondegreen is the author, and it delves into the similarity between the religious cults in days of yore (which I mentioned, but didn't get into, I have elsewhere) and how much the trans movement acts as a cult, and dissects exactly why, and who's attracted to such cults the most. Hopefully you'll find it useful in understanding your daughter better!

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Oct 23Liked by Grow Some Labia

I’m a conservative parent who has one conservative kid and one college-age kid who identifies as trans. I will admit it’s hard to read all of this and examine what part I may have played in my daughter’s descent down the rabbit hole.

In the hope that others can avoid my experience, I’ll share some things I wish I’d done differently.

Number one is social media. At 14, my daughter was too immature and subject to manipulation for social media. She knew not to post personal information, or friend people she didn’t know. What I didn’t know to warn her about was brainwashing - I thought my kids were far too smart and sensible to allow anyone to influence their views like that.

Another thing I wish I’d done is find an activity or organization that would give her a sense of belonging, meaning, and accomplishment. Whether it’s a religious group, a sports team, or something else, it needs to be a place where they feel they belong, where they have a community and an identity.

I wish I’d been more attuned to her social distress, instead of assuming she’d figure out her own way through. I should have moved her to a different school at the first sign, and I should have dug deeper into what was going on and how she was feeling.

Maybe I should have helped her fit in better. She was a quirky kid who always went her own way. Should I have coached her more on fitting in with peers?

Although I was unaware at the time of a lot of the beliefs of transgender ideology, if I could go back now I would have made it clear that I strongly disagree with those beliefs and believe that people who transition are doing harm to themselves.

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Thanks for sharing a conservative mom's take on a trans kid - I figured they were out there but I couldn't find anything much about conservative trans kids. One observation, NOT a criticism: I wonder if she was rebelling against a conservative family? Rebellion is oh-so-typical for kids no matter what families they're in. A liberal ex-hippie, ex-Yippie friend of mine who has sadly passed on raised one daughter who's very liberal and a son who enlisted in the military and fought in Afghanistan and Iraq, and has since become a cop. When he first enlisted I asked my friend if she knew what was going on with that and she said, 'Rebellion, big time.' And John Walker Lindh, the 'American Taliban' who was captured from the Afghanistan War? He was from a heavily liberal family. I got the distinct impression his conversion to Islam and later, to radical Islam, was heavily influenced by rebellion.

I think you're a PITT Substack subscriber, are you not? I think I recognize you. I unsubscribed a few months ago mostly because the stories of trans kids were beginning to sound fairly the same, although I think it's a great support group for parents of trans kids.

It's a cult, and you didn't know...just as generations before missed the countless cults hippie kids got sucked into, and not just the 'Jesus freaks'. Political ideologies aren't much different from religious ones, and both can be turned into a cult.

I hope it works out with you and your child. Fingers crossed that maybe she'll outgrow it. Thanks again for being brave enough to share.

Do you know of any groups where con parents either share their problems with trans kids, or share how to keep their kids from getting sucked into it, esp if they can't afford to send them to non-public schools? I would love to know more about how con parents are fighting this.

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Oct 24Liked by Grow Some Labia

Thanks. Yes, I’m a PITT subscriber. I notice that the parents there seem to be a range of liberal to conservative. I agree the stories all sound alike, but that’s kind of how you know it’s a social contagion/cult. I’m not aware of any support spaces specifically for conservatives. I should also mention that I’m conservative-ish. I’ve always been kind of moderate/centrist/libertarian. My husband is more politically conservative but neither of us are extremely socially conservative, if that makes sense. So I don’t think my daughter was rebelling against strict conservatism, because we weren’t that. I have heard the suggestion, and I think there may be some truth to it, that if parents are kind of easy-going and aren’t going to get too upset over hairstyles or clothes, that kids who feel the need to rebel may choose gender because they know it will upset their parents when less extreme things might not.

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Interesting idea. Although my mother let my brother and I drink alcohol sometimes under certain specific circumstances when were underage (a brandy snifter of wine at Christmas, maybe Thanksgiving, a little beer here and there) figuring if they didn't make it forbidden we wouldn't be tempted to get smashed with friends. It probably worked, although I might not have done that anyway because my friends were 'good' kids who didn't drink and we never got invited to parties because we were all dorks :) And, the few times I went to any I thought the whole getting-smashed thing was just dumb and didn't prove you were grown up any more than smoking ciggies. But, yeah, it wasn't forbidden, I wasn't impressed with it, so I didn't go nuts when I was a teenager.

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Oct 23Liked by Grow Some Labia

I'm thinking Dem youth are also more prone to anxiety and depression because they're more clued in, more aware of social injustice and the difficulty in changing entrenched systems. They tend to care more about society as a whole. Young Cons may be high on disingenuous rhetoric and silo thinking, similar to their parents. Many of them don't seem to care about those beyond their family and immediate tribe. When life is good for THEM, life is good.

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I can agree with this up to a point, having been a young liberal adult (my political consciousness didn't really start forming until high school senior year) and I can remember being afraid of what was going on in the world and ESPECIALLY of dying in a nuclear war, which was a very real threat and in fact we came moments away from it several times (and yeah, I know about the Petrov thing!)

But, I wouldn't blanket conservatives so much. Mostly because it's those on the far right you're describing, who bear a lot of resemblance to our own whack jobs on the far left, who are also guilty of a lot of that. Also, I'm not at all convinced anymore that our young turks are all that concerned about social justice, frankly, so much as they just need enemies to hate and spew venom at.

The social media link is hard to deny. It's not the *only* reason why liberal kids' mental health is worse, but it has a lot to do with it. I really think lack of control in progressive families could be explored more. Strictness AND loving - regardless of which side of the divide one is on. The cons probably err more on the side of strictness. I couldn't find too much about con parenting when I was researching this, but I'll keep an eye out. There's plenty to criticize there too...although the kids I knew who were messed up tended to come from fundamentalist religious homes.

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Oct 23Liked by Grow Some Labia
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Thank you Dave! I haven't read the whole thing but I saved it. It might be more of a skim for me as I read the WPATH Files and it looks like there's a lot of overlap but that it details the role of the US government in covering up the facts and lack of evidence behind this crap.

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A very disturbing trend. I have heard privately of horrifying stories of parents caught up in gender theory who manipulate their children’s identities until they get lost in the trans cult. This cannot lead to any kind of emotionally balanced existence.

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